AI Speaker 0:00

The Pod News Weekly Review uses chapters, so you can skip ahead when James gets bored.

Announcer 0:04

The last word in podcasting news. This is the Pod News Weekly Review with James Critlin and Stan Sethy.

Sam Sethi 0:13

I'm James Critlin, the editor of Pod News, and I'll start taking this DO2000.

Sharon Taylor 0:18

Every publisher wants to access a video audience, but also maintain their revenue and their top and bottom line.

James Cridland 0:24

Triton Digital CRO Sharon Taylor on what Apple Podcasting's new video brings to podcasting.

Kattie Laur 0:30

And there has to be an easier way for Canadian shows to be discovered, and there has to be a better way for all of the talent that exists here to thrive on the medium of podcasting.

James Cridland 0:44

Katie Law on What's Next for Canadian Podcasting. Plus is your favorite podcast using AI. This podcast is sponsored by Budsprout for the tools supporting community to ensure you keep podcasting. Start podcasting, keep podcasting with Buzzsprout.com.

Announcer 1:01

From your daily newsletter, the Pod News Weekly Review.

Interview: Sharon Taylor from Triton Digital

Sam Sethi 1:05

James, we've been covering the news about Apple Podcasts for the last two shows at least. And it's been coming clearer about what the Apple announcement means to the industry. But I thought it would be interesting to take the side from one of the partners that have announced. We thought we'd talk to Triton, but what have Triton been talking about in the last few weeks anyway?

James Cridland 1:29

Well, so Triton actually moved quite early on this. In December, they announced support for video podcasting. It was already then talking about dynamically inserted ads in video, but using MP4, of course. And then obviously in February, then Apple Podcasts starts talking about dynamic uh advertising through HLS in something which is coming with the next version of iOS. And of course, Trident also produces a really helpful podcast report which comes out uh every year in the US. There's also versions for Australia, I think maybe, but certainly for Canada, that had a bunch of information about video consumption. Um so it's a really fascinating company to take a look at.

Sam Sethi 2:15

Yeah, well I thought, well, let's go and find out from the Chief Revenue Officer Sharon Taylor, who's a friend of the show, what this Apple deal means for Triton and how they're going to implement it. But before that, for those who don't know, I asked her, what is Triton Digital?

Sharon Taylor 2:30

Triton is an audio services provider to what started out as the commercial broadcast industry, so a big streaming provider and the ad insertion, and then now all audio, so podcasting on demand, etc. We have a few different pillars. We do podcast hosting through two CMS that we own, Omni Studio and Spreaker. We do all advertising, dynamic and programmatic. We do measurement of the industry, and then we have the streaming business still as well. So anything audio you can think about is trite and digital.

Sam Sethi 2:58

You've now started to make announcements about moving towards video. So the first one was the support for MP4. Uh, and then you did a deal with Spotify. So talk to me about those two and why you went into that video solution.

Sharon Taylor 3:12

Yeah, I think for those that know me, know me as like a real true audiophile. And, you know, when I was running Omni Studio, Omni Studio for years has just been an audio CMS. It's built for podcasts, it's built for audio on demand, and that was Triton's take on the industry as well. We did audio really well and we still do. Obviously, in the last few years, all of us have watched this groundswell towards YouTube and podcast video in general. And in the early days, some of us with our tinfoil hats were like, it's a flash in the pan, it wasn't a flash. And so I think how we thought about video has changed as the market kind of has moved. Essentially our job is just to be a hosting and distribution and monetization platform for audio content. And if audio content is becoming video as well, then we need to do that. And so halfway through last year, we decided to build video into the Omni Studio CMS so that publishers could upload an MP4. And Apple at the time was really the only one that allowed MP4 in RSS. It's not new technology, it was Apple's best or worst kept secret. And so we built that as like a beta product because for us on video especially and for me, it's very, very important that a publisher stays in the driver's seat of their audience and then monetization. Because I think we've made missteps as an industry over the years of giving away the keys to that kingdom. And for us, it's really important that how you monetize and the ads that you run are delivered from a central point. And so that's why we did the MP4 RSS to start.

Sam Sethi 4:50

A lot of other hosts have intimated that, oh, it's far too expensive to do MP4. You have to download a one gig file, it's too much, why would we do it? Yada yada. Where have you found the cost model then? Because clearly you've decided to implement it, but is it a big charge to the podcast creator covering your cost? Or have you found a clever way of downloading MP4s at a reasonable price?

Sharon Taylor 5:14

No, we control the file size, and so I think at the moment we're only doing 720. The reality of that beta product is it still exists. It was great for many reasons that I outlined, like remaining in that driver's seat, but it's challenging because it was published to Apple specifically. As a podcast consumer, and I will admit that I'm firmly locked in Apple's ecosystem, but I'm not leaping out of bed on a Monday morning, looking at Apple Podcasts, all of the shows that I already follow, and then thinking to myself, I should search again for this show to see if there's a video version. And one of the downsides of the NP4 product and the way Apple does it is that it had to be a separate show. And so candidly, like uptake of that was not huge, but it did give us the foundation for what turned into surprise conversations with Spotify and Apple as they announced their own offerings. And so we were ahead of the curve in terms of a UI to allow for video upload. And it gave us a lot of good learnings in terms of how to push the file down. Video advertising and video delivery is wildly expensive, to your point. And so I think that that was for the framework, and now we can move into the Spotify Apple offerings and take that learning with us as we figure out the model for consumers and for publishers.

Sam Sethi 6:29

Apple in the past used to have a filter for audio and video. Do you think they're gonna have to now update the UI to bring that back?

Sharon Taylor 6:38

From what I know of what they're planning, and obviously, like we were a launch department for the announcement for HLS. Apple are very good at only letting Apple know what they're gonna do and you know, very successful at that. Their UX and their UI, I think, is going to change quite drastically to let users toggle between audio and video, and they think public about how they're gonna change that. I think that the podcast consumer on Apple podcasts and how they want to find video, there'll be lots of learnings there. And then we'll be able to toggle between the two. And if publishers still want to have a whole separate show, they could do that as well. But I think there's a lot we are yet to find out in terms of how that's gonna roll.

Sam Sethi 7:17

Okay. Now, one of the things that I've been banging the drum about is something called the alternative enclosure. I think Triton have now supported the alternative enclosure. Is that correct?

Sharon Taylor 7:28

Yeah, that's correct. Yep.

Sam Sethi 7:30

What do you think people start to use the alternative enclosure for?

Sharon Taylor 7:33

A lot of our customers have their own and operated apps. A lot of our customers have their own aggregator apps that pull in content from the rest of the podcast ecosystem as well. And so I think it's too early to understand what they want to do with it, but we knew that there was a groundswell that is asking for the alternative enclosure URL. And so it's just our job to make sure that all the technical opportunities are there for publishers to choose how they want. I think it'll be mostly in their own apps because you want to, again, that driver's seat analogy, you want to remain in that seat, especially to control costs of like allowing people and where you want to distribute that video out.

Sam Sethi 8:09

Now, along came Spotify, knocked on the door of Triton and said, Hello, we're going to do video. What has the relationship been?

Sharon Taylor 8:17

My thoughts on Spotify, and I say this to their face, and so I don't think they'd be upset if they're listening to this. It is a wall garden. It has been historically. And in order to monetize on Spotify or upload a video, it really meant cutting off your RSS feed. I was speaking to a publisher just this morning who still uploads the video into Spotify. And the access to the video audience is enough of a carrot for them to cut off their advertising because obviously it breaks RSS. No longer can you get dynamically inserted ads, programmatic or direct sold. And so it's been a hard sell, I think, historically, for publishers to think about that. It is fascinating that publishers think about YouTube video totally different to audio first apps. Publishers seem to think of YouTube as this whole different platform. It doesn't matter if my ads appear in it. I'll just burn them in as video reads and I'll take the YouTube money. That thinking hasn't pulled across into Spotify, especially, which are doing the same business model, which is you upload something separately to their system and then you allow them to monetize it if you're on their platform. But it it really does split apart from audio advertising. And so when they came to us, it's because they wanted to open the door to a greater amount of content on their system. And so I think they came to us and ACast and AudioBoom and a couple of others. And so we now have access to an API that would allow publishers on Omni to push a video file out to Spotify. It still does not allow for dynamic ad insertion. And I personally am very passionate about that. And I think Triton's job is to ensure that the ads that you run appear in as many places as you have an audience for. And so I'm interested to see how that develops over time and how they respond to what Apple has put in the market. Again, hopefully that rising tide lifts all of our podcasting boats.

Sam Sethi 10:07

Apple came out with a bombshell announcement. We're going to be doing video HLS. You'd already announced that you're going to be supporting HLS as a platform. So that was really good. With the new way that it works, as a secret API key, you deliver an HLS playlist to Apple, and then those ads get injected into the audio. How have you found as Triton adopting to this new model? Have you had to change anything? Is it just business as usual? And we've just got on with it. How's it been?

Sharon Taylor 10:46

At the moment, it's business as usual. We still have a couple more weeks to finish off the HLS build. And so now that we can talk about it with publishers in the industry, it has been received incredibly well. I feel like, again, that driver's seat, every publisher wants that. Every publisher wants to access a video audience, but also maintain their revenue and their top and bottom lines. And so the conversations have been incredible in terms of how people are thinking about it. How we are approaching it, I think, is another layer of our video offering. It's not going to be for everyone. Video is expensive to create, and we should talk a little bit more about the advertising structure that Apple is offering and how the HLS will be delivered. Like HLS will still be delivered via download and auto downloads will still be enabled. And I think the jury is out on what advertiser appetite for video advertising in a video podcast that's downloaded will be. So I think we're in a like a watch and wait there along with many publishers. But in terms of HLS and the opportunities that affords podcasting to move into a more streaming-focused world, I think is the biggest upside that we are hoping for.

Sam Sethi 11:57

And so this feels like you as a partner now are going to get first-party data back because you're the ones delivering the video as a HLS file. So you've got the information now that used to be encapsulated and controlled by Apple.

Sharon Taylor 12:12

I do think that is one of the beliefs out there. And it's one of the conversations that we've been having, especially with publishers. But what is transmitted back is still largely in control of Apple. And so the reason we built HLS and were building that before the announcement is because, again, we have all these publishers that have got their owned and operated apps. And we do believe that that is a nice way. If you could get to 10% of listening and prove that like an ad was listened to, is that a big enough of a sample to stop the industry commentators from saying that, you know, podcast ads aren't listened to, even though it's been a decade and ads are listening to the line. I saw James on LinkedIn with you the other day. Advertisers wouldn't come back if it wasn't working. And I think we are very unique as an industry. Like no one in the out-of-home industry talks about, oh, well, are the eyes actually on the billboard? We know that advertising as a beast works and there are some assumptions built in. So with HLS and obviously it being streaming, yes, the protocol allows for that, but only if the player sends things back. And so, no, we don't get to see anything about first-party data that Apple won't send us. And I think that's also a nice thing about podcasting, that it is a less privacy-invasive version of other advertising that's out there. And so, no, we won't be able to see that, not on day one. As the industry moves, and I think Apple has shown they're quite good at listening to industry feedback. My hope is that advertisers and publishers say, hey, we would love some extra data back. And in a way that kind of helps us control the release of that data and the narrative around it to the advertising industry, as opposed to it just being one day, it all just moves to streaming. Because that's going to be hard to get our arms around and talk about coherently, I think, to advertisers. And so this is a nice first step into that world, I hope.

Sam Sethi 13:58

Do you think Apple will enable HLS in the primary enclosure without this API? So within the RSS model?

Sharon Taylor 14:05

Oh, I don't know. I don't know generally.

Sam Sethi 14:07

Okay. That would be the ideal that the step one was we'll get through this secret API because we want to control the add revenue spend and measurement.

Sharon Taylor 14:15

Well, I mean, they're listening to this primarily, probably to make sure I don't breach an NDA, but if they're listening, it would be great. Yeah.

Sam Sethi 14:21

It's okay. We cut out all the bits that you're not allowed to say.

Sharon Taylor 14:24

No, no, no, don't say that. Because I'll think that I breached it and then like you edited it out. I didn't. I didn't.

Sam Sethi 14:29

Anyway, let's get back on track.

Sharon Taylor 14:30

So um it's so early days. And I think that, especially as the industry gives feedback, I think that what we have today is going to be different to the next version of this episode we do in a year's time.

Sam Sethi 14:42

So Spotify must be sitting there going, hang on a minute. Apple has gone to these partners and they've said you host it, you pay the cost of hosting and delivery. And if there's any naughtiness in the video, you're liable, but you pay us a little transaction for every ad. Spotify must be saying that's a much better model than we've got right now, where we're giving creators a percentage of revenue.

Sharon Taylor 15:04

Wish I knew the answer, because to your earlier point, like none of this data has ever been released. I do think it's quite telling as well as an industry that we're all moving to video, but there's not really any revenue data out there. Like if the pot of gold was substantial at the end, I do think that's again why I like our MP4 RSS and the HOS idea, because again, you control that and you can forecast and you can budget and you can understand like what your costs are going to be. I don't know what Spotify would be thinking at the moment. I would imagine that the Rev share is probably greater than a CPM that they could charge. I think YouTube, Spotify, and Apple have been watching the industry and making adjustments. You know, there's a reason that Spotify announced that this API would be open to more platforms. And so yes, I think that they will adjust because that's what they've done in the past, all three of these platforms, how they adjust and how they position themselves uniquely in market compared to YouTube and Apple, while they're all, you know, essentially fighting over audience, and we are just hoping to catch some benefits as an industry on the way through. I don't know. If I was at Spotify, I would be thinking about a different model for sure.

Sam Sethi 16:19

Now, you've got the title of Chief Revenue Officer, so I'm gonna ask you, what do you think will be the uptake then of people now saying they want to put their ads into video on Apple?

Sharon Taylor 16:32

I'm a little sceptical, personally. I think that, especially on day one, the opportunity of putting ads into a video podcast on Apple exists. Whether that's 1%, 10% or more, I think in the initial phase, those numbers feel right to me. I think the jury is out on how existing advertisers will respond to what Apple is offering. Like, there's a video advertiser that exists right now in the industry, like writ large, in advertising. And they are used to getting very specific video metrics back. They are used to getting average view duration and all the things that YouTube give. I don't know how they're going to respond to this new offering, which is a primarily audio first audience, listening to audio ads or getting video ads in their video show, but as a download and as an impression. That market size could be substantial. And it's obviously why we have jumped at this opportunity because it is like the next kind of meaningful revenue move. Will existing advertisers who already understand how podcast downloads work be the first ones to come in? Like I feel like the first step will be transmitting maybe like a logo or you could do product placement for the advertiser now in the show if you have a sponsorship. Like there are other ways to drive a CPM higher, I think, and to show that there is a new audience on Apple and maybe the revenue growth in general, if the CPM stays flat is what makes up the difference. Basically, my quantifications are I hope so, I think so. I don't know what that number is. And they haven't launched yet. Like ask me in two months and I'll tell you what I can.

Sam Sethi 18:08

Now, looking beyond that then, one of the interesting things I wanted to cover off with you was where you see the market going. Now, Triton released a report recently, which was a state of podcasting 2025, and in it, the I think the result was 7% watch video at a dedicated mechanism. The middle ground was about 80%, and the remainder was just audio only. So can you really extrapolate that you know the audience is moving away from audio to video, or is it everyone's just happy to mix and match? What did you take as a summary of that report?

Sharon Taylor 18:44

The report was fast, like we've had amazing pickup on that report, and I think it's because it does show the nuance that does matter between creators and advertisers. There's a lot of industry commentating around podcasting Z Long Live Video, which I don't subscribe to, like I said at the top, an audio file, and I want to listen because you know it's just how I choose to consume this content. But I think the report showed that that is still true. Like, yes, there is a watch-only audience, but there is still like nearly 13% listening exclusively via audio. And then we showed that show genre consumption is dependent on the genre. And so, like history, for instance, is very audio first. I think we also showed that sports and music lent more towards video, which makes sense because as a consumer of media, there are things that you sometimes want to watch and there are things that you sometimes kind of want to listen. And so I do think that Apple getting into the game is a unique audience. Like YouTube is video first. This is a consumer base that is very video focused, video first. And so, of course, all the data to date has been about people wanting to watch podcasts. Apple podcasts is a primarily audio first medium and the way that they are pushing it out. I do think it's a different audience there, and how they choose to engage between the video and audio will be really hopefully tasty data and really quite telling. Because I do think that as an industry we need to remember that audio first is podcasting. Do you know what I mean? Like we're such an interesting piece. Like a book can be an audiobook, but it's adapted differently for TV or movies. And yet we have decided that like our visual version of the shows is the same as the audio version. And I think that's telling in the data based on the audience numbers, because uh how people choose to consume, if it's an audio-first experience, makes sense that they're kind of that 80% a swapping between the two, because sometimes it might be interesting enough to watch, and other times it's still uh audio-first and powerful as like a relationship in your ears.

Sam Sethi 20:49

Now, one of the new entrants into the market is Netflix. Yes. Which surprise, I mean, is it cheap TV? Is it filling out the schedule because they can't? Or is it the fact that I I think I said it's James. I watch YouTube during the day and I watch Netflix at night, and the two never really mix. That's from a brit. Of course, I understand YouTube in the North American market is also a primary channel, but generally that's how I see it. Has Triton got a relationship with Netflix? Will you be working with any of those podcast platforms? Will you be surfing ads, or is there nothing at all that works between the two of you?

Sharon Taylor 21:26

At the moment, Netflix are doing licensing deals direct with the publishers and creators. And so they're just getting the video file separately and then pushing onto their onto their own servers. And so there's no technical gateway there between us. There are other apps that have come to us and said that they would like to get the video versions onto their podcast apps. So funny with Netflix and Hulu getting into it. You know that meme with the butterfly? And it's like, is this a podcast? I forget who it was. Like I listened to a podcast called The Town, and there was a wonderful woman on there who I will now butcher what she said, which is Netflix and these entertainment giants are not getting into podcasting because they want to be in podcasting. They have an audience who are looking for a certain type of content and podcasting has a lot of content and they are marrying that up and then using the halo effect of podcasting to try and hopefully move an audience there as well. And so it's just content being found by an audience. I don't imagine a world where Netflix and others are pulling from the RSS feed or even looking to a podcast host like us to like get that file because their systems are built specifically for video in a very specific way. I am interested to see what happens with Apple TV. We're not pushing 4K to your point about costs. But maybe Apple TV puts podcasts there as like follow-up to the shows the way that Disney Plus is doing potentially. And maybe because they already have the relationship on the Apple Podcast side, maybe that's an easier doorway, especially onto mobile devices. But no, Netflix and and the entertainment industry a bit larger are doing what they want to do and calling what they want to call a podcast. No shade.

Sam Sethi 23:01

Yeah, and the marketing departments I think is spot on like are using the halo effect. This is a podcast. No, it's not a podcast. It's not even a podcast on YouTube. Correct.

Sharon Taylor 23:08

And then we get like looked at like the insane ones because we are pushing our glasses up of our nose and saying, but it's not an RSS feed. And then we immediately lose the media argument at that point. And so, you know, that's fine. I'll take the halo effect on our side as well.

Sam Sethi 23:23

Final question, Sharon. One of the interesting things is we're seeing a lot of content go towards premium content. We've seen big numbers really from Patreon, $2 billion paid out to content creators. How do you see the market going between the advertising and the premium content? And how does Triton deal with that? Do you provide premium content capabilities as well?

Sharon Taylor 23:45

Okay, yes, we do. And I have thought about this for a long time. So we built a product called Secure Distribution five years ago. Again, for the publishers that have got their owned and operated apps, and it allowed them to sell subscriptions without having to think about a third-party platform. So if you have your own membership database and your own payment gateway, you can sell that and retain a lion's share of the revenue. Again, that driver's seat analogy that's really important to us. But we do integrate with Spotify open access. And then we were one of the launch partners that Apple chose as well for the premium feeds that they have for delegated delivery. And so, yeah, I think that especially as business models continue to change and as video plays a larger role. Our job is to just allow for whatever model publishers want and mix and match if you want a show that is premium, have a show that's premium. Going back to video, I would love it if some of those things were able to do premium video as well. Because I think that also solves part of the advertising conundrum with video podcasting. So no, I mean 100%. I think paid audiences work for a very specific type of show. I don't know that it works for podcasting, you know, as an industry writ large, because the content's been available and ad supported for so long. But for a very specific show with a very engaged audience and a huge fan base, I think it's an amazing business model.

Sam Sethi 25:06

Now, if I want to find out more about Triton, Omni, Spreaker, everything that you guys do, where would I go?

Sharon Taylor 25:13

Head out to TritonDigital.com is the best support of call. There's a blog there, there's like a whole pile of information that we keep updated around what's going on in the industry and what we're up to, and a way to get in touch with us there through the contact form.

Sam Sethi 25:26

And last and most important question, will we be seeing you for a beer in London?

Sharon Taylor 25:30

Yes, I will definitely be there. Yes. Looking forward to it. Filet of the podcasting calendar of the year, honestly.

Sam Sethi 25:35

Excellent. Sharon, thank you so much. Congratulations to everything that you guys are doing. It must be exciting right now with all the things that are changing and moving around. It gets audio, video, HLS subscription. It's a good time to be in podcasting, I think.

Sharon Taylor 25:49

It's always been a great time. I've said it's every year that I've been in the industry, that it's a great time to be in the industry and an interesting time to be in the industry as like everything kind of changes. So yeah, it's continuing to be another one in 2026.

James Cridland 26:02

Sharon Taylor from Triton Digital. Um I was um uh learning more about Apple Podcasts and HLS uh earlier on in the week. One thing that I have heard is that uh Apple Podcasts has more video content on there, um, but I'm not quite sure how to search for it because at the moment it's very difficult to search for the video content. So I'm looking forward to seeing a little bit more of that. And also, apparently, one of the publishers is already doing dynamic video advertising. So I'd like to see a little bit more of that as well. Um, I believe that uh questions are being asked uh somewhere. Can we tell James about this feed that we have? Um so uh hopefully I'll be able to have a look um at that. But uh yes, things moving on apace, and of course, Apple talking at um Sounds Profitable and Podcast Movement Evolutions at South by Southwest um talking at that conference uh all about uh their new HLS podcasting

AI disclosure is coming

James Cridland 27:05

as well.

Sam Sethi 27:05

Talking about things moving on apace, James. Uh it feels like since the beginning of the new year, podcasting 2.0 is gaining more traction or at least wider adoption. We've seen Apple, obviously, with the TXT uh tag and obviously with chapters and transcripts, and now we're seeing video. Um iHeart and Triton obviously are adopting HLS video, and the latter two are adopting the alt enclosure. It seems that you know all this work over the last three years is finally beginning to resonate. But this week, uh Alberto Botella, who's the co-founder of RSS.com, put on Mastodon that he's also putting up a new tag proposal for AI disclosure. What's he talking about, James?

James Cridland 27:50

Well, so he um Alberto believes that um there should be some sort of disclosure in the RSS feed that a uh show has been made or an episode has been made with AI. Um and it's not quite, you know, my my issue with made with AI is well, what do you mean? This show is made with AI. Our show notes are produced by Buzz Broutz's co-host, uh, who are our sponsor, of course. Um uh the voice that you hear right at the beginning saying something about chapters, she's totally AI through Wondercraft.

AI Speaker 28:24

I am totally AI.

James Cridland 28:26

Does that mean that we're made with AI? Um, so that that's always been my issue with this, but Alberto strongly believes that a little checkbox should be available. So, firstly, rss.com has added it. There is a checkbox for all rss.com users, um, which is made with AI, and you check that. Um, but also there is a really helpful little um thing when you press the information button next to it as a really helpful explainer of when you should be um saying that your show is made with AI and when you shouldn't. Uh, and that's a really helpful thing.

Sam Sethi 29:01

Yeah, one of my questions as you posed was you know, what element of AI within this show should then qualify for us to have to self-register? So Alberto's actually created a website called shouldidisclose.ai, which allows you to answer several questions and then determine whether you should or shouldn't put the tick box for AI, which is quite nice. Um, you can also go and listen to a podcast from rss.com called AI Disclosure in Podcasting, which actually has the new tag built into it, plus 16 other podcasting 2.0 tags that it supports.

James Cridland 29:41

Yeah, I mean it's it's it's very nice. So at the moment, at least, um rss.com is using the uh is using a version of the podcast.txt tag, um, which um I I'm not sure is the is the correct uh thing to do, but nevertheless, it does mean that you can just launch something now and see what happens. And it's important that it is in a tag or at least is programmic or is programmatically available in some way, shape, or form, because I would suspect that at some point advertisers will want to know is this show made with AI? Um, in the majority, um, and advertisers will want to be um aware of that, and the best way of doing that is to um have a simple machine readable tag in your RSS feed next to those particular episodes. So I think that that is a whether or not the TXT tag is the right thing, I think that that is an absolutely good plan. Um Apple at the moment, if you want to put an AI show into Apple, then they are asking that you disclose it both in the episode notes but also in the audio as well. Not necessarily something that many of the companies who are producing AI podcasts are doing, I should say. Um, but I think also making it programmatically readable so that um a computer can understand whether or not this has got AI in it uh is a very useful thing. So as of now, um I believe that uh TrueFan supports it, and I believe that uh the Pod News um uh podcast directory pages also support it. Well, I know that the Pod News ones do. Um because you encoded it. Because I coded it. And it does look as if there are a couple of other um podcast companies, podcast hosting companies who are already saying this looks like a good idea, we will do that. Um and I think that that that all all of that makes a really good idea actually. I suppose one of the questions that I would have is who's gonna be driving this? Um because it can't just be rss.com driving it. So will it be the podcast standards project? Um, does it does it fit into that? Will it be, but you know, somebody like sounds profitable? Does it fit into that? The IAB? You know, who's gonna be the industry body that actually drives um an AI disclosure forward? And I'm not quite sure what the answer to that is quite yet, but it would be nice to know.

Sam Sethi 32:07

In my my opinion, I think it I've always looked at the podcasting 2.0 community as the RD arm and the podcast standards project as the marketing arm. That's how I in my head see it. And so I'm hoping that if we I think the qualifying bar for getting something adopted as a standardized tag from the podcast 2.0 community is I think one app and two hosts, or two apps and one host, whichever way, anyway, that seems to be the bar, and then it gets adopted. That then would throw it over to the podcast standards project, who then would then promote it into the hosting community because that's where it's going to be driven from. Um, I don't see the IAB touching this with the barge pole for a while, um, and I'm not sure about sounds profitable, but I yeah, I think it is that role of the community first to get some adoption, which is why I jumped on it quite quickly as CEO of TrueFans to get it working, and I know you've done it. Um But yeah, let's see where it goes. I think the TXT is a little bit of a um a workaround is the best way.

James Cridland 33:14

I mean it's a workaround, it's a clutch, but I think the nice thing about that is that you can you can play around with that uh tag and you'll never break anything because it's part of the podcasting 2.0 standard. You can put any old stuff in that TXT um tag, so that's fine. Um I think if we were going to say, well, we need a you know, we need a new tag for AI transparency, then that's a conversation which um will take months. Um, and you'll get the usual podcasting 2.0 crowd that wants to make everything as complicated as they possibly can. Um and actually just moving forward with this and just saying, okay, yes, this is made with AI, or no, it's not, um, you know, is the thing that makes sense. I think also, interestingly, um uh Apple Music has just added um a specific tag in their metadata as well. So if you are a music publisher, um and uh you you can um put information in there, and the Apple Music one is actually just as simple. Um the uh it's got three things instead of one, so ours is just a tick box, Apple Music's one is it this was composed by AI, that this music video is um generated by AI, or the sound recording was generated by AI. Um, so one of those three, and you can see that actually that does um that does fit together quite nicely from Apple Music's point of view. Um I I think the podcasting one is is even simpler um and probably doesn't need to be too complicated right now. Um so I think that certainly uh the industry is moving in this way, and I think that's a good thing.

Sam Sethi 35:02

It'll be interesting if Apple Podcasts adopts the same uh tag within uh the um spec for Apple Podcasts in the iTunes spec. Um what would that mean? Would we replicate that then? Would we change our wording in the podcast tune?

James Cridland 35:19

Well, yes, and and I suppose the question really is, you know, um, is Apple working on anything like this? I mean, to to be fair, the music metadata is totally different. Uh metadata doesn't use anything to do with uh RSS. Um but but yeah, I mean maybe this is a conversation that that should be going on with Apple um and with uh Spotify uh as well. But you can very clearly see I think that music is a bit of a different case. Um although maybe it isn't. I mean, maybe the the definition of um of composition is script writing, and that's much the same, you know. And the definition of uh sound recording, well that's um that's your uh AI clone voice, isn't it? So um, yeah, but certainly um I think starting with a with a simple tick box makes a bunch of sense, and I think seeing how far we go with that uh and how keen the industry is to actually clean up its axe and make sure that it's really you know simple and straightforward. I think one of the things that Alberto is very keen about uh is to make sure that there's no um, you know, you don't get marked down because you've ticked that AI box. Now that might be the case from Alberto's point of view. I can almost instantly see that um, you know, OP3 will use that as a signal, um, that some podcast hosting companies will use that as a signal for their advertising, um, and that some apps will use that as a signal as well to hide some of the AI content. So, you know, I I suppose we just need to see what happens there as well.

Sam Sethi 37:00

Now, Alberto did mention that Spreaker has been collecting this for a while when I questioned who else was doing it, and he said they've been collecting a true-false value and adding an automatic disclaimer in the episode description. Well, given that Spreaker is the host for Inception Point AI, I wonder is there a feed I can find that I can test against that would show that this is being disclosed as AI?

James Cridland 37:25

Well, I mean, certainly having a look at um some of the Inception Point AI shows as I was doing a couple of days ago, uh, there is still uh very varied um mention of AI in those shows. Uh I mean, I was told in November that they had added clear disclosures in all of their show notes, if not in their audio. Um, but that certainly is not the case yet. So I'm not quite sure what's going on there. One thing, one person though that I have asked to have a look at uh at Alberto's should I disclose.ai website um and give me their opinions and views is Janine Wright of of Inception Point AI because she is clearly going to be impacted if this sort of thing moves forward. Similarly, John McDermott from Calaroga Shark Media. They use AI in a very, very different way. Um, and I'm keen to understand what he thinks of it uh as well. And I've already got a few bits of feedback from other people as well. Um, so I find I find all of that quite interesting in terms of what people are going to be saying about this AI disclosure and whether or not that's going to be useful, and indeed whether or not advertisers see that as being useful as well. Um I'm sure that Inception Point AI would argue that advertisers don't care uh as long as um the audience, you know, buys their stuff. And from that point of view, I think that they would have a point of view there, and that that point of view probably isn't actually wrong. So um, yeah, a ton of a ton of information there.

Sam Sethi 39:01

Well, it's only early days, let's see where it goes. Now, um,

Audible new plans

Sam Sethi 39:05

one of the other things that you've reported about this week, let's move on, is is it goodbye wondering? Is what I took it as, James. You you've talked about Audible has a new lower price subscription offering for people who really like podcasts. Right. So tell me more about it, because I think this is Goodbye Wonder Plus, isn't it?

James Cridland 39:23

Well, it is Goodbye Wonder Plus. So Wondery Plus has been um announced that it's closing, um, and this is its replacement, essentially. Um, so it's a new standard plan from Audible, uh, which gives you um unlimited access to Audible Originals, which are the fancy podcasts inverted commas that Audible makes. There's no RSS feed, so are they a podcast? Hmm, there's a question. Um, but also it gives you access, I think yes, but anyway, uh also it gives you access to 200 shows previously available on Wondery Plus. Interestingly, not all of the shows previously available on Wondery Plus. Um, and you get access to one audiobook a month, and that's $8.99, um, which is their new standard plan. Um, Wondery uh is a closing, and if you actually if you visit the Wondery Plus website, um you can actually get this new Audible lower priced plan for $5.99 a month for the first year if you go through the Wondery Plus website. Uh I noticed. So um I'm sure I've made friends by linking through to that. Um, but that's interesting. So you can compare that with, for example, Spotify. Um, Spotify has an audiobook only plan, which is $9.99 a month US, uh, which gives you access to 15 hours of audiobooks, which is essentially an audiobook. Um plus you also get access to ad-funded music and podcasts, of course, in there. Um, and for $12.99 you you you get no ads in the music and the podcasts and the same amount of audiobook. Um, and then obviously um uh uh Audible has um bigger plans in there as well. Um, so uh yeah, it's I mean it's fascinating watching Audible basically going there are people out there we think that will be interested enough in getting access to our premium podcasts and one audiobook a month which you can't carry forward. That's the big difference between their $8.99 and their $11.99 plan. Um there are enough people there that we think that we can um earn more money through that uh and not cannibalize the um the people who are paying the $11 uh or the $12 plan. Um so I mean you you're an Audible reader, you're an Audible user. Will you be um will you be moving down to this uh s standard offering? Um because it I mean it gives you much the same, doesn't it?

Sam Sethi 41:54

Well, no, it's the carry forward. I mean, I've got a library of books that I I have now, and I don't want to lose that library. And secondly, I don't really want to subscribe to anything in Wandry Plus, so it doesn't really appeal to me at all. Um is this the start of Amazon finally uh you know smashing together three different units into one? Because we've always said it's the outside-in company, you know, Amazon Music has podcasts, then you had Audible, then you had Wandry. Um Wandry seems to be the one that's now being sucked into other parts of the business. Um will they eventually be sensible and put Audible into Amazon Music, or Amazon Music will remove podcasts and put it into audible? I don't know, but is this the start of that, James?

James Cridland 42:40

Well, I do think that there's something in having a separate brand, uh spoken word, um, which is the Audible brand. I do think that there's something there. Now, weirdly, of course, just to make this even more complicated, um, if you don't want to pay $8.99 for the Audible um uh new standard subscription, then you can pay $11.99 a month. That gives you Amazon Music Unlimited, which is essentially Amazon's um uh version of uh Spotify. Um you get access to ad-free podcasts from publishers like Acast, for example. And now you get access to one free audiobook from Audible each month, but you don't get access to the Audible Originals podcasts. I mean, how much more complicated can they possibly be making this? So unfortunately, I think it's still a case of Amazon with two different competing brands in a bag fighting rather than three different competing brands in a bag fighting, but at least they've brought it down to two, I suppose.

Sam Sethi 43:44

Yeah, I I again uh one of my questions was when we were talking last week about Apple and you know doing video, and we were talking about YouTube, and we were talking about Spotify, neither of us mentioned Amazon.

James Cridland 43:56

No, no, exactly. I mean, Amazon is unfortunately still in Incredibly small. And I don't really know why that is, because the product isn't too bad. The product in terms of music, it's just as fine as Spotify or YouTube Music or anything else. And you would assume that Amazon have the marketing clout to promote Amazon music to everybody. So I'm I'm a bit confused as to why they've so significantly failed to produce any sort of real um market heat with uh their music service. Um Audible actually, you know, is is a bit bigger. If if you think about audiobooks, you will think about Audible. I mean, that's the number one. Um so I I would certainly agree there. But in terms of, you know, I mean, uh Amazon Music Um and Amazon Prime, to be honest. I mean, you know, we're enjoying the night manager at the moment on Amazon Prime, which is excellent. But even Amazon Prime is not, you know, um, it's certainly not given the same QDOS as Netflix or HBO Max or you know, any of these other services.

Sam Sethi 45:13

Well, uh let's see if this next iteration of Amazon makes any difference, but I certainly won't be uh downgrading. Let's let's put it that way.

James Cridland 45:21

No,

Interview: Kattie Laur, podcasting in Canada

James Cridland 45:22

indeed. Now, earlier we spoke to Sharon Taylor, who's based in Quebec in Canada. Canada's a fascinating place for podcasting with lots of US content and a much smaller industry of its own. I was curious to learn a little bit more about that. So let's move a little bit south to Brantford in Ontario, which the tourist information website says is an exciting city.

Kattie Laur 45:43

I am Katie Lohr. I am the principal and executive producer of Pod the North, uh, which is well known as a Canadian podcasting newsletter all about the industry and what's going on here. Um, and under sort of the umbrella of Pod the North, I am also a podcast producer and audience growth consultant and creator and all-around podcast Canadian podcasting advocate.

James Cridland 46:07

And how cold is it where you are at the moment? Because we're always told that Canada is very cold.

Kattie Laur 46:12

It's actually not as cold as it was a couple weeks ago, but it's only about two degrees today.

James Cridland 46:17

Oh, okay. Well, yes.

Kattie Laur 46:19

Yeah, but we did have some hail, it all melted, and now we have a whole bunch of ice coming this weekend.

James Cridland 46:24

So That's what you need. That's what you need. It's 29 here.

Kattie Laur 46:27

Must be nice.

James Cridland 46:28

Yes. I know, I know it gets up that way during the summer. You're fine. You're fine. You just have to cope with the rest of whatever it is that you're currently in. Podcasting in Canada, the one thing that I know when I look about podcasting in Canada is I look at the Canadian podcast ranker, and there's loads of Canadian shows in there, and I go, oh wow, all they listen to there is Canadian shows. And then you realise that the Canadian podcast ranker from Triton uh is participating um podcasts only, and the only people who are participating really are Canadian podcasters. So what um what does uh the Canadian landscape look like? Are there lots of um people listening to stuff from the US or is there a vibrant Canadian podcast industry?

Kattie Laur 47:17

So I get most of my stats from the Canadian Podcast Listener Report, um, which has been really interesting to watch because I've been downloading it for the last, I don't know, decade, it feels like. Um and over the years, it's really interesting because there's sort of this idea in Canada that we are always consuming American content more than anything. Um, and over the last few years, it's actually treaded upward uh where Canadians are listening to more Canadian content than American content. It's only by like one or two percentage points, but it's still noteworthy. And I honestly think that in the last couple of years, just based off of what's been going on in the US and you know, Canadians feeling like we should value our sovereignty, um, there's definitely been more interest in listening to Canadian shows uh and Canadian podcasts. So I've seen that go up, and I think that's part of the reason why. Um, so yeah, that's kind of where things are at. I think it's about a 50-50 split between Canadians listening to Canadian content versus American content or content from elsewhere in the world.

James Cridland 48:25

Yeah, I mean uh uh the Canadian podcast listener, this is from Signal Hill Insights and Ulster Media, and they seem to show um, I mean, Canadian podcasts still in the minority, but about 43% of shows. 56% of shows aren't Canadian, but um, you know, but as you say, I think the trend is in the right direction. And it and it's fascinating that the Canadian podcast listener seems to show that longtime listeners listen to a lot more stuff from the US in comparison to newcomers. Newcomers, only 21% of all of the shows that they listen to are coming from the US. So I'm and I'm curious as to why that is. Is is that just because Canadians are now better at talking about their own shows, or or is it, as you say, the political stuff?

Kattie Laur 49:17

That is such an interesting stat, and I was so blown away by seeing that. And it's hard to say what it is that's really impacting that. Uh, I mean, it I can't help but think it's political. That's just where my brain goes. And I it's not that like Canada doesn't have its own experience of of racism and discrimination here, but I think like we've clearly opened up to see immigrants and newcomers come come to Canada and there's a lot of diversity here and a lot of different kinds of people making podcasts. Um, so I don't know, it's just kind of interesting. I feel maybe maybe people feel safer to listen to Canadian content uh and different perspectives here than in the US right now. Um so I'm curious to see if that's gonna shift over the next couple of years. Uh and I don't know what the stit the stats are compared to a few years ago either. So it's a very interesting stat to me.

James Cridland 50:10

Yeah, yeah, no, it is. It's absolutely fascinating. So, in terms of um Canadian podcasting, um, the one thing that I know about Canada is my goodness, you are a country that likes your regulation. Um, and the CRTC, uh, which is the media regulator, um, they do an awful lot of media regulation on radio. And a couple of years ago, they were making noises that they would do some regulation for podcasting, not quite the same. They were talking about regulating people like Apple Podcasts and Spotify, the places where you go to listen, to basically push there to be a bit more Canadian content on their front pages. I think there's probably quite a lot of that already, though, isn't there?

Kattie Laur 50:55

It's actually surprising. There there isn't too much right now. Man, the CRTC thing is so interesting to me because my brain can't help but feel two ways about it, which is like, yes, we should definitely be encouraging Canadians to listen to homegrown content. Um, because for so long, like we've just been inundated with American content, and there's sort of this culture here that anything that's coming out of Canada just like isn't good and the quality isn't good. Um, and there is validity to that because a lot of the arts in Canada is so under-resourced and underfunded, including podcasts, but many just different kinds of mediums, that like our production quality really doesn't cut it sometimes. Um, and so we've entered into this weird sphere where it's like, I don't know if you can really regulate Canadians to be forced to consume Canadian content, but I do think that there's a lot of work that needs to be done to make it easier for Canadians to find Canadian content. Um, earlier last year, Apple Podcasts put out a Made in Canada uh editorial category where that made it just so easy to find a whole bunch of Canadian shows. And that's the one thing that I think it's missing from uh the podcast apps is just geographic filters. Like what it should be a lot easier to find perspectives, at least from where I'm based, uh, to talk about certain things rather than hoping and praying that a show is Canadian. Like you there's really no way to tell where somebody is from or where a show is being produced from on any of the podcast apps, and like that's the type of work that I want to see happen, rather than just regulated against all these tech companies.

James Cridland 52:38

Exactly. Well, you you and I should um definitely talk about the podcast location tech, which will fix all of that. Yes, um, uh absolutely will. Um but uh no, so I I I'm I I am interested. Uh I mean, certainly when you look at what radio has to do in Canada, then a percentage of all of the music that they play, for example, has to be Canadian. A percentage of all of the content that they carry has to be Canadian. Um and I and I'm curious as to whether or not podcast apps and those sorts of things can be um better telling that Canadian story. Certainly it sounds as if the Apple Podcasts um made in Canada idea uh seems to have worked quite nicely.

Kattie Laur 53:23

Um really yeah, it was only around for a few months and then it then it was gone.

James Cridland 53:30

Wow. Yeah. Wow. Well that seems uh that seems a missed a missed opportunity. So are you working uh to sort of talk um uh to sort of talk up Canadian podcasting more or what what what what is your um you know what is your purpose? You know, I what is your purpose on this?

Kattie Laur 53:52

Think about that every night when I put my head on my pillow. It's a great question, James. I think my purpose uh stems from just who I am as a producer and my own work um and who I've learned from in this community. I've always wanted to work in radio and media. And when I graduated from university way back when, and there was no jobs in radio, because of all the reasons that you know, James 2 in Canada, um, and found out that podcasting was basically my opportunity to make radio, but on demand and do public radio. Um, through doing all of this stuff, I've met just so many incredibly talented producers with like wonderful journalism backgrounds, with sound design backgrounds, just people who are making incredible stuff. And a lot of these producers are people that like, you know, 99% Invisible has been hiring. There's a whole bunch of Canadians who work on that show that are just sort of floating under the radar. Um, but all this to say, like, there's all this incredible talent in in podcasting here in Canada. And I just found that when you looked at the podcast apps, they were just going completely unrecognized. Like none of their shows were showing up anywhere. Nothing was being there's nothing in service of the content they're making, and the content is good, like really good. So to me, that was I mean, I was thinking about my own content too, like why the heck am I working so hard on all these shows and nobody's seeing it. So that's kind of where the passion came from, which is like there has to be an easier way for Canadian shows to be discovered, and there has to be a better way for all of the talent that exists here to thrive on the medium of podcasting. And just none of that exists right now. So that's my purpose is to figure out how to make that happen, basically.

James Cridland 55:42

Now, one of the things that's um happened in the UK quite recently is Audio UK has um done a very successful campaign to get the audio industry recognized as a creative industry, and that means that they get um now l listened to officially by government. Um there is a creative industries um, you know, sort of uh committee get together, um, and uh audio is uh actually has a place in that um in that part of the world now. Is there is there such a thing going on in Canada at the moment?

Kattie Laur 56:18

I honestly haven't seen anything like that. Um I I like I can firmly say I don't think so. Um I will say that there's been some interesting things coming out of like some of the funders, uh, the like grant funds in Canada. The most notable one is the Indigenous Screen Office. Um they're funded through, I believe, Canada Council for the Arts. And that's really the only funding that's going to any podcast from Canada Council for the Arts, uh, like distinctly. Um, so the Indigenous Screen Office is able to put out, I think they've almost given out a million dollars to Canadian to Indigenous podcasts in the last three years. And it they're doing it in a really wonderful way where they're just sort of saying, like, here's the money, go make the thing, rather than giving them all these sort of stipulations of like, well, it has to be sort of this way, this done this way, it has to have this sort of narrative arc, um, which has been really, really wonderful to see. And so I think that's been really successful over the last couple of years. And I've noticed, I've like definitely noticed indigenous creators who started out making podcasts have been getting more notoriety here, which is really, really cool. So now I'm looking at the grant funders being like, okay, what do you got next? Like, hello, what's happening? Um, and actually something really interesting happened to me last week where with this uh announcement of Apple Podcasts, I uh and video, I had been hearing some rumblings a little bit about how there was maybe some people from Canada Heritage Fund or Canadian Media Fund uh kind of asking people what they thought about the podcasting space and kind of how they might want it to be funded. And I was like, okay, well, where's that person? I like I'm the person to talk to here. Where are they? And then I finally got a message on LinkedIn last week uh from someone from the Canada Media Fund saying, Hey Katie, we've been thinking more about podcasts and specifically in the video realm. So this is just sort of the thing that I keep seeing in Canada, which is like they're still not quite thinking about podcasts as an audio-only medium. They're really thinking about it as a multi multi-medium sort of platform. So there's like uh one show that was built out of uh uh being a video game, like an interactive video game that had a podcast that you could sort of listen to as you went. Um, there's been a number of different narrative style audio uh podcasts here that are also stage plays. Um, so it's interesting that like Canada really wants the podcast to be part of a larger art project almost. And that's still what I'm seeing here.

James Cridland 58:57

And do you think therefore that um Apple adding video will actually help? Because you you will be able to do a proper multimedia uh experience, I guess, with that?

Kattie Laur 59:08

It's so hard to say because video has existed already on Spotify, and so and this is the thing like why are we only funding podcasts that also do video? Like you and I aren't even doing video right now. Like why do we have to have video? And this opens up a whole myriad of concerns that I have that I've been yapping about on the internet these days. Um I just think we're so behind if we're still only thinking about podcasts as as video.

James Cridland 59:37

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think from my point of view, serial was such a seminal point in podcasting. Um, but you couldn't make video out of that. I mean, you could, but it would have been a documentary and it would have taken millions of dollars to make, and it would have probably taken a year and a half to put together. Um and we've lost so much if we just assume that a podcast is now two people having a chat uh in front of three locked-off cameras.

Speaker 8 1:00:09

Yes.

James Cridland 1:00:10

Um that that that seems to me not what podcasting is kind of all about. And that seems a bit of a that seems a bit a bit of a shame and a bit of a missed opportunity that yes, okay, if you want chatcasts, chatcasts are fine, but chatcasts aren't the same thing as, you know, uh as a uh as a fully formed, you know, as S Town, for example. How could you make S Town into video? You you simply can't. You simply can't.

Kattie Laur 1:00:39

The interesting thing about this in Canada too is that CBC Podcasts, for example, has just been absolutely crushing it with their slate of true crime series. Like they are getting global notoriety around these series, and those would be incredibly difficult to do in video. And I've noticed that they've been putting out some uh short form content online that is uh it's really well, it's really really well developed, um, where you've got sort of the host talking a camera and doing a bit of a tease about the series, and it works really well, but then that's all you can kind of do for a full narrative investigative series. Like and and CBC is like doesn't have all of the funds either. Like that's our public broadcaster, and um, so that's there's a lot of cultural stuff here in Canada where people want to defund the CBC altogether. Um, and so that's kind of happening here with the weird political cra clashes that happen. So um it's really interesting because I don't even think CBC can thrive in a video forward uh podcast landscape.

James Cridland 1:01:47

I mean they make plenty of uh of TV as well, but I I would agree with that. And I do wonder I do wonder in one side the CBC does a fantastic job um at producing some great shows. You know, Frontburner is obviously a fantastic show, it does very, very well. But on the other side, it's almost as if they're getting they're getting I was gonna say lots of money, they're getting some money from government to fund what they do, but that then makes it a bit harder for everybody else, for Canada Land, for you know, um, whoever, whoever wants to be involved in that. And I and I almost wonder, it it was interesting when you look right back at the beginning of podcasting. Dave Weiner was saying that it was great that you had somebody who was producing an NPR-like show in terms of the open source podcast, Christopher Leiden, who was the first um in averted commerce podcast. That was great, but that was so polished and so um public radio that it was kind of scaring some people away. And I thought that that was very interesting. And you look at, for example, in the um uh in the Canadian um uh data, the number one uh ad sales network is Sirius, number two is Wondery, number four is Audio Boom, number five is NPR, and the only Canadian one there is number three, um CBC R Radio Canada. So I I I I kind of wonder, in the same way as the BBC exists in the UK, I kind of wonder whether or not the CBC is both brilliant for podcasting because loads of people are listening, loads of people understand what it's all about, but also quite um uh quite uh difficult for podcasting because it it's actually this great big um, you know, this this great big um uh I was gonna, you know, albatross, elephant, uh large animal, uh, in a room with plenty of small animals. Um and uh yeah, so I don't know. It's a it's an odd one, isn't it?

Kattie Laur 1:04:01

It is. And I do worry that, you know, CBC being the gold standard of Canadian podcasts does set maybe like um a bit of an unattainable standard uh for the rest of the indie shows out there. But there are some, there like are so many incredible shows that are doing something completely different that are wonderful to listen to. Um, but you know what I find is lacking the most, and I hate to say it because I don't love capitalism, but money. Like I I just find that in in all of my work in in podcast growth, like money really comes through for audience growth when you do really well-rounded and strategic targeting. And if you're able to do that and hone in on finding a podcast audience that is completely aligned with another show, uh you are golden. And just people don't have money to experiment with marketing tactics or anything like that, let alone like setting up a video camera in front of them and putting out numerous pieces of content to that are like complementary to their show.

James Cridland 1:05:04

Um and is that is that because advertising in Canada isn't working as well as it is in the US in terms of an ad revenue model?

Kattie Laur 1:05:13

So the Canadian Podcast Listener Report put out some info a couple of like maybe a month or so ago, that was saying that the advertising uh landscape for podcasts in Canada is about seven or eight years behind the US. And this has been such a classic story for the Canadian culture, is that we are just so risk averse that like it takes forever to just like make a move and try something out here. Um, and it just feels completely opposite to the way things are and the way the industry works in the US, where people are just sort of throwing money around all the time, it feels like. So here in Canada, it's really difficult to lock down a sponsor on your show, especially. When you are a podcast, a Canadian show that's focused on a Canadian audience. And, you know, most people will say, well, just make your show for a global audience and just expand your reach. But there's value in making content for people at home. People want to be seen and they want to see their stories reflected in the stuff that they listen to. And this is what I found with my own show, Canardian. It's a show where we gossip about Canadian hometowns. And so it's clearly a show for Canadians to listen to. And I got an Apple Podcast feature two years in a row, and it really helped me grow my audience. But only one season did I really have the resources to produce video. And even with a really successful um Apple podcast pit uh feature, I think my audience was somewhere, I was just under 10,000 downloads a month. And like that's the threshold to get any sort of sponsorship on it, right? Um, so like that is a what I would say is like a pretty successful Canadian podcast because I seemed to get a decent amount of listeners who stuck around. Um, but there's a whole bunch of Canadian brands here who have never ever dabbled their feet into podcast advertising. So there's a whole bunch of education that needs to happen here. Um, and the podcasts that are by Canadians for Canadians, their audience sizes are just much smaller because we just don't have the population size that the US does if you want to compare it to that. So it's really difficult to like land some sort of sponsorship model on any podcast here. And that's kind of the work that I want to be doing over the next couple of years is really figuring out like, okay, is there a new way of doing this where we don't have to rely on the download anymore and we can price ourselves based off of strong engagements and consumption rates and verified listeners and all the good stuff that the people at Bumper are doing? So I'm kind of looking to those guys to be like, all right, set the new standard for us so that us Canadians can benefit off of it.

James Cridland 1:08:04

Casey, where can we um uh firstly, where can we uh get pod the north? And then secondly, uh, how can we um hear your show as well?

Kattie Laur 1:08:12

Oh, thank you. Um so pod the north is on Substack, it's just podthenorth.substack.com. And then you can also for for now. I'm probably gonna move it. I just you know what would be great, James, if I had some funding. If I could just move over to things that I could pay for that are more ethical, it would be just so nice.

Speaker 8 1:08:31

Yes, fair enough.

Kattie Laur 1:08:32

Um but yeah, so there's the Substack newsletter for now, and then I've got podthenorth.ca, which is my website, and you can find all the other info that I'm up to there. And then my show, my podcast Canardian, is on all of the listening apps out there. And just look for Canardian. The image is a Canadian goose wearing an orange toque. That's me.

James Cridland 1:08:55

Casey, thank you so much.

Kattie Laur 1:08:56

Thank you.

Announcer 1:08:57

The Pod News Weekly Review with Buzz Sprout with Buzz Sprout. Start podcasting, keep podcasting.

Podcasts overtake spoken-word radio

Sam Sethi 1:09:06

So, for the first time in history, James, podcasts are now bigger than spoken word radio. Is that true?

James Cridland 1:09:12

Uh it is, yes. This is new data from Edison Research at SSRS. They look at um all of the stuff that Americans put in their ears, which of course includes podcasting, it includes um music, uh, it includes all kinds of stuff, music radio and spoken word radio. And for the first time, Edison Research is saying podcasts are now bigger than spoken word radio. So 10 years ago, spoken word radio was absolutely massive. So this is, you know, talk radio, sports talk radio, you know, the fan, uh, NPR, all of that kind of stuff. And podcasting was tiny, it was 10%. Um, uh spoken word radio was 75% uh of all spoken word content. Um, and um that was 10 years ago, and now podcasting has just overtaken uh AMFM uh spoken word radio, which is a really big deal. That's quite a change. So you can very much say that podcasting is the new talk radio. Um, so some fascinating research. Um, I think we've kind of been sort of guessing that this would happen for a while, but really interesting seeing that those graphs finally uh, you know, uh finally beginning to cross over. Um so uh yeah, really big uh historical news in terms of podcasting.

Sam Sethi 1:10:34

Now, does everyone agree with you? Does Tom Webster agree with you?

James Cridland 1:10:37

Look, I think this is really big news for podcasting, and I think it does nobody any benefit if you turn around and you try and pick at what the data does or doesn't say, um, and um trying to make some kind of um story about whether your research is better than uh Edison's uh uh research, and also trying to claim that you understand everything about Edison's research in a company where you haven't worked for three years. Um I don't think it's particularly helpful, to be honest, but pretty well everybody else who I've been talking to um has agreed. Stephen Goldstein, for example, Amplify Media, he says that the shift um confirms something that he has argued for years. Podcasting is the new talk radio, and actually the spread he believes is even wider in lower age demos, basically under 55, um, which I'm still just in. Oh, thanks, Gran Old Man. Um, but he he reckons this spread is even wider, and uh, and he's absolutely right. I'm sure he's absolutely right. I've not seen those figures either, but I'm sure that he he is absolutely right. And you know, talk radio, a bit like cable news, is um is is all old old people. Um and there's nothing wrong with old people, but uh, you know, it's a different it's a different world. So I think pretty well everybody agrees that actually this is, I mean, it makes sense, doesn't it? Um, you know, it it it makes sense that podcasting is beating uh now uh spoken word radio. What is not necessarily saying, by the way, is that um uh AMFM radio um has Innova Commas lost audience, just that in the last 10 years, as people have got older, um we've had an extra 10 years of young people um who have focused more on podcasting than they have focused on talk radio. So um so I don't think that the story and Edison Research didn't say, but I don't think that the story is people switching away from talk radio into podcasts. I think rather rather more it's the fact that um 10 years of people have died. We've got, you know, 10 years of young people in these numbers, and that's probably responsible for a large amount of the swing that we have actually seen.

Sam Sethi 1:12:55

Yeah, I look at my 20-year-old children, I say children, young adults, they don't listen to radio. Not a thing. Um they don't walk listen or watch terrestrial TV on the particularly, they they use YouTube. So I think we are seeing a demographic shift in the way that people consume content. Um interesting. Now,

Ad revenue to grow

Sam Sethi 1:13:16

related to that, James, there was a report from Guideline. What did they say?

James Cridland 1:13:19

Yeah, so Guideline is one of the big uh companies that um works out uh ad revenue for all kinds of things, including broadcast media um globally. Uh you might know them as Guideline SMI, you might know them as as uh SMI, the standard media index, if you're that old. But anyway, they are saying that uh US digital audio ad revenue will increase 9.3% this year. Um of course podcasts are in there, um, but uh it isn't just podcasts, it's also um things like um uh streaming ads in uh Spotify and so on and so forth around their uh music. So they reckon, I mean, guideline reckon that podcast ad spend in the US is just over $1 billion. Um, the IEB reckons it's $2.4 billion. They're just worked out differently. Um so just look at the trend, I think. But the trend, um, you know, increasing 10% this year would be um would be quite nice. And what we're what we are seeing from um other figures from iHeart's Financials, from uh some figures coming out of Australia as well, is that um podcasting is outperforming the rest of uh of online audio ad revenue. Um so podcasting doing particularly well here. So if you were to look at this, um you you could probably um you know guesstimate that podcasting um is probably going to go up by about 20% this year. Um and that would be and and that would be quite nice um to end up seeing that. Um similarly, we've seen that kind of information um coming out of uh coming out of Australia recently uh with some new figures that IB Australia have released. Um and uh we've also seen similar figures coming out of the U the UK um with their uh numbers, um the highest ever commercial radio revenue figures, um, which sounds bizarre, but yes, that's um absolutely what's going on. Inflation is a good thing, isn't it? Um but um the real uh growth in there is the online um is the online ads of which podcasting makes um you know a large amount. So uh yeah, all good news in terms of uh revenue

The tech stuff

James Cridland 1:15:28

as well.

Announcer 1:15:28

The tech stuff on the Pod News Weekly Review.

James Cridland 1:15:33

Yes, it's the stuff you'll find every Monday in the Pod News newsletter. Here's where Sam talks technology.

Sam Sethi 1:15:38

Well, I mean the first one is up, is the podcast index tells us that only 55% of podcasts are in English. What's the rest of them in then, James?

James Cridland 1:15:45

Yes, well, the rest of them are in other languages. Um, you're wondering which language being a Brit. Um being a Brit, I don't normally have another language, but go on. Exactly. It's English abroad, or if they don't understand it, it's English but shouted. Uh so so yes, uh Spanish, 14% of all podcasts are in Spanish, Portuguese 5.7%, French and German 2.5% each. Uh why do I mention that? Well, I mention that because Podpage uh is now supporting websites in languages other than English. Congratulations, Podpage. Um, uh, including all of those and I think Mandarin Chinese and uh a bunch of other ones uh in there as well, which is very cool. Um, and if you would like to translate it into your own language, then you can too, because um they're looking for more of those. Uh, I think that's a very clever uh move from uh from their point of view.

Sam Sethi 1:16:38

Um they're also, James, uh they are also migrating uh WordPress websites to Podpage as well.

James Cridland 1:16:46

They are, and this is something which is actually really complicated to do. Um, I know because I've just migrated a WordPress uh website into uh into flat files, and my goodness, the amount of fiddling around that you have to do. Uh, but yes, um, so if you have a WordPress website and you wish to get rid of that WordPress website because of all of the maintenance and the upgrading and uh plugins and all that nonsense, uh then just go to Podpage and they will migrate all of your WordPress website in there. Um and they've really battle tested it because one of the first um websites that they have migrated is the School of Podcasting, which is Dave Jackson's um uh website, uh, which um is uh I mean that was you know 15 years worth of WordPress uh hackery, and the fact that they've managed to uh migrate that uh really well uh is pretty impressive. Um again, you can save yourself money on podpage if you want. Uh podnews.net slash extras uh is where to go. You have to be subscribed to our newsletter in order to get hold of that. But um, yes, there's uh a thing uh as well.

Sam Sethi 1:17:54

One of the companies you wrote about James was Odyssey, which I don't really know a lot about, to be honest, but they're a free podcast hosting platform, but they've done something nice, they've now added an integration with YouTube.

James Cridland 1:18:05

Yeah, so if you go there, you can upload your uh your video and it will automatically stick that onto YouTube for you. Um, and it will also, I think, take the audio and make that available as an RSS feed as well. So it's basically simplifying your workflow, seems to be quite a smart um, seems to be quite a smart idea. Um, so they're not doing any video in terms of their um RSS uh feeds quite yet, uh, but who knows what the future might bring. They have called it a first step in video distribution. Uh, so I think you can read into that uh that they might be doing some of that uh in the future. But um, yeah, Odyssey Creator Lab is not something that I've taken too much of a peek at. Um it used to be um what was Podcorn, uh, which was a monetization tool. So uh it does give you money, it does it sells ads and gives you money and all that kind of stuff. Um and it's run by uh Odyssey, which is the second biggest broadcast radio group in the US. So it's a pretty big uh company with uh quite a lot of backing to it. So again, worth a you know, worth a look at that. But um uh yeah, they seem to be ramping stuff up anyway.

Sam Sethi 1:19:22

I've asked their uh CEO, Leah Reese Dennis, for an interview. Hopefully she will uh join us. Um, because I really want to know, you know, first step. Well, what's the next step? Are they gonna host video? Are they gonna do it in MP4? Are they gonna do HLS? Are they gonna do the alternative enclosure, etc., etc.? So yeah.

James Cridland 1:19:39

Yeah, they're very nice. Um, there's a new version of Podfriend coming out. Um Martin Moritzin says it's very beater-ish right now. I think I'll open it up when I get back from the US after next week. So let's hope that he's he's able to get back to the US um uh nice and easily. Um, but it's looking very nice so far. So I'm looking forward to uh having a play uh with the new Podfriend. We all need new podcast apps because we all get some really nice ideas from them. Uh and um Podfriend appears to have quite a lot of real thinking behind it, so it'll be fun to see.

Sam Sethi 1:20:15

Now, one of the other tools that you uh wrote about was called PodShrink. Now, I know Ashley Carmen wrote a post in Bloomberg, probably about a month or maybe more, about people who are using podcastings not for you know just listening to the audio, but speed it up audio or using AI now to um take the transcript, shrink it down, and just get the keywords, or even just a uh a version. Is this what Pod Shrink is now doing as well?

James Cridland 1:20:44

So I mean what what Pod Shrink does is if you say I would like to listen to the um to the Pod News Weekly Review, uh but I don't have however long this show is, four and a half hours. Um I I come on, what do you people go around the M25 twice, you're fine, stop it. I don't have all of that time. Um so instead you you say, Okay, well, I would like to listen uh instead to uh Joe Rogan's interview with Tom Segura, for example, but I would like to listen to that um uh in just one minute. I don't want to listen to two and a half hours of Joe Rogan and Tom Segura. I mean I'd love them to try and do this show. Good luck. I mean, yeah, that would be that would be fascinating. In fact, in fact, shall we shall we? Yeah, go on. Do you think we should? That would be fun to do. I've got one more credit, because I've I've I've only got three three uh credits.

Sam Sethi 1:21:35

Body's weekly review is in. How can they shrink it?

James Cridland 1:21:38

Right, so which one shall we shrink? Shall we shrink the the massively long one about Apple Podcast video? Shrink it. Okay. Choose duration, one minute, choose a voice, Brian Iniger, or Mike. Uh we'll have Iniger. Um and uh one minute, good luck. And uh generate shrink. Our AI is listening to the whole episode, so you don't have to. So here we go. Um, it may take uh it may take a couple of minutes.

Kattie Laur 1:22:10

A few moments later.

James Cridland 1:22:12

I've got the whole uh two and a half hours down into one minute. Are you ready?

Sam Sethi 1:22:18

We're either gonna get ourselves out of a job or not now. Go.

James Cridland 1:22:21

Here we go.

AI Speaker 1:22:22

This week, the Pod News Weekly Review discusses Apple Podcasts new HLS video support. The hosts explain how this feature allows users to watch video podcasts directly within the Apple Podcasts app, offering a seamless experience with features like variable speed and dialogue enhancement. They clarify that this functionality will be available to users with iOS 26.4 expected in late March. For creators, the episode details two methods for video traditional MP4 files and the new HLS format. HLS offers benefits like adaptive streaming and reduced bandwidth consumption, but currently requires partnering with specific hosting providers like eggast, art19, omni studio, and simplecast. The hosts speculate that Apple's approach, which involves charging for dynamic ad impressions, marks a significant shift in podcast advertising economics, potentially influencing platforms like Spotify and YouTube. Justin Jackson from Transistor shares his perspective, emphasizing the importance of creator adoption and consumer engagement for the success of video podcasts. He highlights the potential for the open ecosystem and discusses the challenges and opportunities for hosting platforms.

Sam Sethi 1:23:54

What do you think of that? Well, I mean, okay. I mean it's it's factual, it's like reading a press release. That's fine. Um I I actually think m part of me actually thinks, why don't you put that as a soundbite?

James Cridland 1:24:07

Oh, that's an interesting idea.

Sam Sethi 1:24:10

Yeah.

James Cridland 1:24:11

You know. So use that use that as a soundbite rather than a clip of the actual show.

Sam Sethi 1:24:16

Yeah, and then people can get one minute of what the show is about and then decide if they want to go and dip into the long version of it.

James Cridland 1:24:23

Yeah. Well that's an interesting uh an interesting thought. But uh yes, I was quite I I have to say I was quite I was quite impressed at that. Um I thought, you know, um, I mean that that uh very w well um explained what Justin said, and Justin spent 20 minutes saying that, and that was a really good summary of what Justin said, a very good summary of what we said, and we spent one hour, ten minutes um on HLS video. So uh yeah.

Sam Sethi 1:24:54

Yeah, but we we we we we gave depth and volume, and you know, there's lots more than than than that. But yeah, when I whenever I read a business book, right, I often by the end of the business book go, there was one idea that was all there was in that whole 300 pages that was extrapolated out much longer, right? Um and sometimes you think, yeah, okay, we we we can talk about it because I think nuance comes through conversation. That's what happens sometimes. Um, and that can't be shrunk down. But that that was interesting, and it sounded like the reading of a press release rather than a podcast. Yes. But adding that maybe to our soundbite would be an interesting test.

James Cridland 1:25:37

Well, yes, and I think you know, uh to be fair, what can you fit into one minute? That was one minute 30 seconds, by the way, so it wouldn't uh wouldn't we it wouldn't win any awards for being accurate. Um but uh yeah, no, I th uh you know it's not not a bad um not a bad thing, but could you actually use that as a uh you know as a sound bite um you know for the um you know for the actual uh uh show, you know, I don't know is the quick answer.

Sam Sethi 1:26:07

Um I think it'd be interesting to try. Last but not least then, James, um you you're a big Shaw fan. What have they done?

James Cridland 1:26:15

Yeah, so if you've got a XLR microphone, um a nice XLR microphone that you like and you want to keep on using, but you don't want to carry around the big chunky XLR cable and you don't want the audio interface, your focus right thing, and all of that, you just want to plug your nice XLR microphone into your nice phone or your laptop, then you can do that now. And in fact, you can do that even better now with uh something that Shaw brought out called the MVX2U. Uh, it's a tiny little thing that you basically plug into the microphone, and uh the other side of it has a USB connection. Um, and what's quite nice about it is that it um adds EQ and dynamic compression on there as well if you want it to, and all of that kind of thing. Um so it's a very nice uh tool. Um so um you can even plug it into the SM7B, so you can turn that into a USB mic if you want to. There's no reason why you shouldn't. Um so uh yes, very smart and worth a peek if you want to um get yourself something that will just allow you to take that nice XLR microphone that you have on the road, perhaps.

Sam Sethi 1:27:20

Maybe that's a Christmas purchase for you,

The inbox

Sam Sethi 1:27:23

James.

Announcer 1:27:23

Boostigram, boostigram, boostergram, super comments, zaps, fan mail, fan mail, super chats, and email. Our favorite time of the week, it's the Pod News Weekly Review inbox.

James Cridland 1:27:38

Yes, so many different ways to get in touch with us. Fan mail by using our link in our show notes or boosts or email, and we share every bit of money that we make uh as well. Uh thank you to Brian Ensminger, who's top of the streaming stats again this week. Uh, thank you, Brian. Also Oscar Merry coming up behind him. Uh so thank you, Oscar, uh, for that. Uh a bunch of uh super Comments in uh TrueFans. Um there's one from Silas here, Sam.

Sam Sethi 1:28:06

Yeah, I have much more sad view of podcasting Tido apps. Not only did we fail to get apps with nice video experience, but I think across the board there really aren't any actually nice and fully featured apps until I'm finished working. So he's working on his own one. Good.

James Cridland 1:28:22

Um yes, well, good, Silas. Uh, I'm looking forward to seeing that. Where's John Spurlock's app? You remember he said that he was going to be laurishing a lot of it.

Sam Sethi 1:28:30

Barry Libret's app as well. Where's that been updated too? Yeah. Yeah. Where are these apps? Easier said than done. John Spurlock. They talk the big talk, and when it comes to it, they realize how hard.

James Cridland 1:28:41

Talk the big talk, and then they and then they start whining on about having actual clients who are actually paying them. Oh dear. Anyway, um, Neil Vlio, um, who uh was listening to uh Siobhan McHugh. I bloody love this woman. She speaks truth about AI in podcasting, particularly her comments about Inception Point AI. Uh thank you, Neil. Um uh sending a thousand and twenty-four uh sats. Also um another 20 sats. Oh, big spender. Uh Unreliable Trivia with Sam Seth is the best feature to exist. I enjoyed playing around with that. Is the best feature to exist since Karnak the Magnificent from Johnny Carson? I don't know who Karnak the Magnificent is from Johnny Carson, but thankfully YouTube does. So I'm off to take a peek at that.

unknown 1:29:33

Right.

Sam Sethi 1:29:34

Um yes, thank you very much. I did I laughed my socks off when I when I uh had that. So yes, well done, T.

James Cridland 1:29:40

Yes, Unreliable Trivia. And and um yes, I also enjoyed having a bit of unreliable trivia with me as well at one point. Uh so that was uh slightly embarrassing. Um and Seth Goldstein uh saying great intro for some reason. Uh oh yes, that was right at the beginning of last week's episode. Uh whatever the whatever the AI voice, whatever I programmed the AI voice to say. Can't remember now. Um he was also saying that not being able to manually skip ads is bad UI. Um that was uh something that I was saying about um the Apple Podcasts spec. I can absolutely categorically confirm now that Apple Podcasts will not be uh stopping people from skipping the ads uh in either video or in audio. Um so the fact that it is in the main Apple spec has nothing to do with anything. Um and this is what you get when you don't open up your spec for podcasters. Um but my understanding is that that spec is going to be opened up, uh, which is good. And my understanding of why they haven't opened up the spec yet, by the way, is that um well they're act they're actually making changes to it. Um as more people are playing around with the spec or working out what's easy to build, what's difficult to build, blah, blah, blah, um, then they are actually taking that into um in into points of view and um and changing what that spec says. So as soon as the spec is finalized, um, then I would imagine that we will see some of that on the Apple Podcast website, which is I think a good thing. Good. Uh Matt Cundle, uh 5,151 SATS uh using Fountain. Thank you, Matt. Question, he says. A few weeks back you had Tony Doe on the show live, and you mentioned that you cleaned up his audio a touch. What tool did you use? I I used the uh the wave um uh tool, um, which is called Voice Regen. Uh you'll find it at waves.com. Um and uh I had access to the uh beta for that. It's a great little tool. Um so uh yes, I ended up using that. Uh thank you for asking. Um it's a very smart little tool. Um, it's just a one-click and away you go. Um uh so uh that's very nice. And an enigmatic and exciting uh message here. 333 sats from Chad F using customatic test number two. Test number two. Yes, well, exactly. What did happen to test number one and test number three, four, and five? Yes. Uh no idea. Uh anyway, um, oh, and we should also thank James Burt. Um, because James Burt ended up um doing something which I thought was really, really nice. Uh he ended up, he he's he's on LinkedIn um and uh was very good on LinkedIn, ended up doing um uh you know posting all kinds of stuff. Um and I and uh he ended up posting a video.

James Burtt 1:32:45

Morning, James. I hope you're doing well. I thought it would be only apt given how much talk there has been of audio versus video and video versus audio and HLS and all that kind of good stuff. It only seems appropriate. I said in a voice note today rather than sending you a little message. But I just want to say a big thanks uh and sincere um gratitude to you and Sam for the effort that you guys put into Pod News Weekly every single week. Um, you know, the discussion on Apple for us technical morons like me who um I'm like, oh cool, Apple does a video, great, I'll tell them all my clients. But actually, when I've uh got halfway through this episode, I've driven from South London all the way to the coast in Kent, I'm still only halfway through. Um, but I obviously it's a lot more nuanced than the uh the initial news that makes it look, and there's obviously some great opportunities. So again, just a big thanks to you and Sam for taking the time to make such great content that adds so much value to so many people within the industry. Without you guys, it um yeah, we wouldn't be moving at the pace we are.

Sam Sethi 1:33:44

Yeah, no, I it was I was really chuffed. I uh I I saw it and it brought a very nice smile because yes, you know, a lot of work went into that episode about Apple Podcasts, and James gave us a glowing reference.

James Cridland 1:33:57

What a nice man. What a nice man. I thought that that was uh that was an excellent thing. So thank you for that. By the way, if you do want to send us voice messages, please do. Weekly at podnews.net uh is where you will find us. Thank you so much to us uh power supporters. Um you can go to weekly.podnews.net, hit hit the dollar sign uh and uh support us as some of these fine people have. Martin Lindiscog, uh John Spurlock, the man who promised us an app.

Sam Sethi 1:34:23

Don't encourage it. We don't need any more competition. Bugger off, John. Go and focus on OP3.

James Cridland 1:34:31

Uh Silas Vote, um, Seth Goldstein, and uh and James Burt himself. Um thank you all for being uh power supporters. Uh you there are 23 of those right now. Um we would love to see a 24th and a 25th and a 52nd. Um you're more than welcome.

Sam Sethi 1:34:53

Yes is where to

Sam and James's week

Sam Sethi 1:34:55

go. Uh so what's happened for you this week, Sam? Uh well, just very quickly, then we did the AI content tag with RSS.com. So that's all working. You know, nice step one. We'll see where it goes. Um we send out a lot of emails. You found a bug for us, James, so thank you very much. That's now fixed. Um, but we are adding in granular email controls because we obviously get a lot of feedback, and one of those is I want to turn on some, turn off others, so it's not an all-on, all off. So that's coming out this week. And uh yeah, the video testing is still going well. Um getting a couple of issues with the CDNs, so we haven't been able to push it live, but um, we'll get there, we'll get there soon. Excellent, excellent.

James Cridland 1:35:39

Well, that's good. So, what's happened for you? Um, I've had a pr a pretty quiet week. Um, I I'm trying to think of something that's interesting to tell you, which isn't James has bought a new a new toy. Um but but uh well, you know, I actually haven't even bought a new toy this week. Uh so I know it's it's no good at all. So, you know, really can't tell you very much. Um uh other than uh yeah, it's been a nice quiet week. Looking forward to going to Riga in a couple of weeks' time. Uh I've discovered at least one person who is um doing a brewery tour, so uh that's a tick. Um so looking forward to that. But I am also um we uh I'm looking forward to talking to somebody who lives in Riga, uh who is a podcaster. Um I'm not sure he's going to the show himself, um, but uh I do know that he's um looking forward to having a chat with me, and uh we will um go and find a beer uh somewhere. So who knows? That might be a guest on the show uh if I've got my little microphone with me. Where just just a question, where's your flight going? I am not going via any of the Arab states. So just check in. So that although there are lots of Australians apparently who are going via Dubai or Doha or somewhere else, good luck with that. Good luck because uh that's gonna be difficult. Um so Target target process. So I'm going via Hong Kong, um, and then Hong Kong to Helsinki, and then Helsinki down to Riga. Oh, that's a long way. So uh it's it's it's not actually um it's not actually a long way round in comparison to any of the other way rounds, and I would much rather be going that way than going via Huthrow anyway. So um yeah, so I'm I'm quite looking forward to um to that trip. It'll be with Cafe Pacific for the first bit and then with Fin Air for the uh second bit. Finair is brilliant because they do um firstly when they wake you up with the lights after the big long flight, they wake you up with the lights, but they pulse the lights in sort of blue as if it's um as if it's the northern lights, which is a really neat, neat trick. Um and the only uh juices that they do on the flight, they're very paired back in terms of the stuff that they do. The only juices that they do on the flight are either water or blueberry juice. Um and so this time last last year I was uh laughing with uh Todd because the literally the only juice that I could get on this flight was blueberry juice, which I thought was amusing. So uh yeah, so there we go. But yes, uh I've uh successfully avoided flying via the Arab states, which is probably a good thing right now. Um but I'm sure that everybody involved in all of this knows what they're doing. And that's it for this week. All of our podcast stories taken from the Pod News Daily Newsletter at Podnews.net.

Sam Sethi 1:38:38

Uh you can support this show by streaming sites like Brian Ensminger and Oscar Murray. You can give us feedback using the BuzzSprout fan mail link in our show notes, or you can send us a boost or become a power supporter like the 23 Power Supporters at weekly.podnews.net.

James Cridland 1:38:54

Yes, our music is from TM Studios. Our voiceover is Sheila D. Our audio is recorded using CleanFeed, and we edit with Hindenburg. And this podcast hosted and sponsored by Buzz Sprout. Start podcasting, keep podcasting.

Announcer 1:39:08

Get updated every day. Subscribe to our newsletter at podnews.net. Tell your friends and grow the show. Support us and support us. The pod news weekly review will return next week. Keep listening.